From the Shah's Court President to the Revolutionary Judiciary Secretary; The Narrative of Shirin Ebadi

On the fortieth anniversary of the February 1979 Revolution, an event that has impacted the lives of Iranians over the past four decades, we have highlighted the narratives of historical figures or Iranian activists in the years leading up to and following the revolution through forty interviews. In another program from this series of interviews, we turn to Shirin Ebadi; a lawyer, writer, and the first female court president in Iran. The Nobel Committee in Norway awarded the Nobel Peace Prize to Shirin Ebadi in 2003, making her the first Iranian woman to receive this honor. During the revolution, Ms. Ebadi was 31 years old. She currently resides in Britain and lives in London. In a special interview with Shirin Ebadi, we ask her about the days of the 1979 revolution and how she was demoted from her judicial position to a secretary in the judiciary. Ms. Ebadi, you were among the first female judges in Iran and began judging in Iranian courts at the age of 22. After several years, at the age of 29, you were appointed as the first female head of Branch 24 of the County Court. If you could, please tell us about those days and the working conditions in the Iranian judiciary before the revolution. My working conditions before the revolution were favorable. As a judge, I had independence in my decisions, and I remember that in one case, the Pahlavi Foundation, which belonged to the court, had taken land, and the landowner, with sufficient documentation, sued the Pahlavi Foundation, and I ruled in favor of the landowner, and the ruling was executed without any issues. At that time, the laws were not like today's laws, and corruption in the courts was much less than it is today. After the revolution, you and indeed all female judges were dismissed from your positions, and in the same Ministry of Justice, you continued to work as a court secretary, and after apparent widespread protests from female judges and lawyers, you worked as a judiciary expert. If you could compare your working conditions after the revolution with those before the revolution, what would you say? I can say that the working conditions after the revolution in the judiciary were terrible. As you mentioned, after we protested a lot, we were returned to work as experts, not judges. I had to stay for a while to complete my 15 years of service to be able to retire early. During this time, my boss was someone who was not even a judge; he was undergoing his judicial training. However, because he was male, he had become the head of the department, and if he passed his exams well, he would become a judge, starting from scratch. We were under him with years of brilliant service because we were women. I remember one of the decisions at that time; I was in the section for abandoned and heirless property, and if you remember, there was a war in Afghanistan at that time, and there was no central government yet. Some Afghans had come to Iran for construction work. One day, a worker had an accident in the street and died, and when he was taken to the forensic department, it was discovered that he had 200 tomans, meaning 200 one-toman coins in his pocket. Since he had no heirs in Iran and no one recognized him, after burying the body, the 200 tomans were brought to our department and a case was opened for him as abandoned property, which came to me. I wrote that since the heir of this person is unknown and the police had previously investigated and could not find anyone, and his colleagues also said he had no one here, and there was a war in Afghanistan, this 200 tomans should be deposited into the state treasury. Because according to the law, abandoned property must be deposited into the state treasury. My boss, who I mentioned was an intern, said no, this is not correct. We must wait for peace in Afghanistan, then we will have an ambassador, then we will look for the heir of this person, find the heir, and give him this 200 tomans. Until then, the case must remain open, and every six months, a judicial order must be issued on it so that the case does not become statute-barred. I argued with my boss that doing this and taking up an employee's time costs the government much more than 200 tomans. After all, how long do you want to keep the case open until, God willing, peace is established in Afghanistan, we have an embassy, and then we look among all these people to see if Yaqoub-Ali has an heir or not? This is one example of the decisions I had to obey because my boss was someone else. Anyway, it was a torturous life, and fortunately, as soon as I completed 15 years, I applied for retirement and retired. After your retirement in 1992, you managed to obtain a law license and established your own law office. You usually accepted to defend human rights cases, including the so-called serial murders of Dariush and Parvaneh Forouhar, the case of Zahra Kazemi, and some other civil activists. If you could name some of the cases you defended. After I retired, according to the law, I could immediately apply for a law license, and they should grant me a license. However, despite repeated requests, I remained at the door of the Bar Association for seven years, and they did not grant me a law license. The reason was the articles that had been published by me, and at that time the Bar Association was managed by a lawyer appointed by the judiciary, who had absolute authority and refused to grant me a law license for seven years. After seven years, when I received my law license, in my first visits to the judiciary, I noticed widespread corruption that existed. I mean, you had to bribe to get things done, and since I was not someone who would give bribes, I found that I could not handle this, and therefore, I inevitably went towards cases that did not require bribery. And those were cases where I had to defend those whose rights had been violated, the victims. In this regard, I took on many cases, including being the lawyer for Dariush and Parvaneh Forouhar, I was the lawyer for Zahra Bani-Yaghoub, the young girl who went to prison and her body came out 48 hours later; I was the lawyer for Aryan Bashni, a young girl who was killed because of an unjust law in her father's house and away from her mother; I was the lawyer for Leila, a young girl who was raped and killed; many other cases, including Zahra Kazemi, if I want to name them, it becomes too many. Yes, Ms. Ebadi, here I would like to ask you to choose a song to be played during this interview. The song "Namahrabani" sung by Elaheh. Ms. Ebadi, we will continue the conversation and move on to the Nobel Peace Prize awarded to you in 2003 in Norway, making you the first Iranian to receive this prestigious global award for your human rights activities and candor in speech. How did you feel when you heard this news? It is very natural that I was happy and at the same time surprised because after a long time working in Iran, I did not imagine that my fame had become so widespread. Of course, I had previously received several international awards, but it was still interesting to me that my work had come under such scrutiny.