Host: Sussan Taslimi Guests: Lerta Hayrapetian, Abbas Nalbandian, Hamid Samandarian, Nasrat Karimi, and Parviz Fannizadeh Music: Moonlight Sonata by Beethoven Dinner Menu: White Fish and Pomegranate This week's host is Sussan Taslimi, one of the most famous actresses in Iranian theater and cinema, with critics considering her the best actress in the history of Iranian cinema. With over forty years of artistic experience, she has played some of the most memorable roles in films by Bahram Beyzai, with the most notable being in the film 'Bashu, the Little Stranger.' After the Iranian Revolution, she emigrated to Sweden in 1986, where she continued her artistic career in Swedish and is now a recognized cultural figure there. In addition to acting and directing, she also holds cultural responsibilities in Sweden. Ms. Taslimi lives in Stockholm, and I spoke with her over the phone.
About Sussan Taslimi: Sussan Taslimi is one of the most famous actresses in Iranian theater and cinema, with many critics considering her the best actress in the history of Iranian cinema. With over forty years of artistic experience, she has played some of the most memorable roles in Iranian films, and after emigrating to Sweden, she became a well-known cultural figure in that country.
Ms. Sussan Taslimi, welcome to the program. If you could tell me who the five personalities you want to invite to your gathering are?
Thank you for your kindness. I also thank you for inviting me to your program. The five people I have chosen are Ms. Lerta Hayrapetian, Mr. Abbas Nalbandian, Mr. Hamid Samandarian, Mr. Nasrat Karimi, and Mr. Parviz Fannizadeh.
I will definitely ask you later to provide more details about each of your guests for our audience. But before that, dear Ms. Taslimi, I wanted to see what music you would like to play for your guests.
Moonlight Sonata by Beethoven.
Ah, one of the most beautiful pieces. Why do you like Moonlight Sonata, Ms. Taslimi?
Sussan Taslimi: I remember that I loved this music from a very early age, I think it was during my childhood and adolescence. It is very pleasant, and listening to it makes one happy, and in my opinion, there is also a sadness in it. It has a dual state, so to speak. I also thought that if one has a gathering, especially a nighttime gathering, this is a music that is calm and pleasant.
Your first guest is Ms. Lerta, who I think is one of the oldest actresses in Iran.
Guests of Sussan Taslimi: Lerta Hayrapetian
Lerta Hayrapetian (1911-1998): Iranian cinema and theater actress Works: Othello, Eugenie Grandet, Night of Execution, With the Honorable, Secrets of the Treasure of the Genie Valley, and other works Reason for invitation: Lerta is one of the very old female actresses who stepped onto the stage at a time when it was not common for women to perform. She was a very dignified, composed, and humble lady and kind. She was the first lady of Iranian theater.
As you mentioned, Ms. Lerta is one of the very old female actresses who stepped onto the stage at a time when it was not common for women to perform. However, I must say that at the time I heard her name, she was not in Iran, and after the coup that occurred in the early thirties, she left Iran with her husband, Mr. [Abdolhossein] Nourian. But her name was always present, and whenever theater was mentioned, she was also mentioned. Because I grew up in a theatrical family... But Ms. Lerta, who had left after the coup, returned again. I think she returned in the early forties.
Yes, she left in 1953 and returned in 1963. But it was in the fifties that she joined the workshop theater at the invitation of the theater workshop, and it was very good. That was where I first saw her.
You also acted in a play with her. I think it was 'The Quiet of the Sleepers,' right?
Yes, it was 'The Quiet of the Sleepers.' I must also say that when Ms. Lerta came to the workshop theater and I saw her for the first time, it was extraordinary for me. She was a very dignified, composed, and humble lady and kind. And soon she adapted herself to the type of acting that had become more modern in the fifties, and her work in the play she performed for Mr. Arbi Avanesian, 'As We Were,' along with Ms. Fahimeh Rastgar and Mr. [Alireza] Majlesi, was extraordinary.
I remember that Mr. Bijan Safari came after this performance, kissed her hand, and said, 'Ms. Lerta, welcome to your home.' It was extraordinary. We presented the play 'The Quiet of the Sleepers' in 1977 at the Four-Sou Theater to honor her for fifty years of acting in Iranian theater.
I acted in two plays with her, one was 'Little Eyolf' by [Henrik] Ibsen, where Lerta played the role of the mouse woman, and the other was 'The Quiet of the Sleepers.' In these two plays, she had a very positive impact on me. After the ceremony was held in her honor and the play was dedicated to her, the revolution occurred, and she went to Austria and did not stay. In fact, it was her last work.
In the play 'The Quiet of the Sleepers,' we had a very good relationship. I will never forget something. The play was in three acts. In the third act, the mother dies and is present on stage as a corpse. Mr. Avanesian said, 'Ms. Lerta, it may be hard for you to sit on the chair on stage for half an hour, forty minutes as a corpse; would you like to not be on stage and rest, and we will put a statue in your place?' She said no! Even the role of a corpse is a role; I will play it myself. This lady sat on the chair as a corpse for more than half an hour. I will never forget it. She was a star; she was the first lady of Iranian theater.
Your second guest is Mr. Abbas Nalbandian.
Guests of Sussan Taslimi: Abbas Nalbandian
Abbas Nalbandian (1949-1989): Iranian avant-garde playwright Works: From Seven to Nine and a Half, From Death to Death, If Faust Had a Little Understanding, and other works Reason for invitation: I first became directly acquainted with Mr. Nalbandian when he was the manager of the workshop theater. Our view of theater and plays at that time was different, but he wrote in a completely new way. In my opinion, his style of writing was close to the world of poetry.
I first became directly acquainted with Mr. Nalbandian when he was the manager of the workshop theater. Before that, I had heard his name because the play 'A Profound and Grand Research...' had been performed. I found it very interesting that he had never had any connection with theater before writing this work.
According to him, he had never seen a theater or a play. He even says that he did not graduate from high school. But during the summers, he worked at his father's newspaper kiosk. At the age of eighteen or nineteen, he wrote the play 'A Profound and Grand Research...' and, according to himself, he did not write it to be performed. Even those who read it did not understand anything from it because our view of plays and theater at that time was different. He wrote in a completely new way.
What was new about it? It seems that his plays were very bold and used everything.
Yes, yes. The newness was that our playwriting at that time had a so-called traditional line... He broke all of that. I mean, in my opinion, his style of writing was close to the world of poetry. Even the play 'A Profound and Grand Research...' that was raised at that time, everyone said, well, how can this be performed? Eventually, Mr. Avanesian said, I will perform it. Well, it was performed and provoked reactions that some people liked it very much, and some did not like it and showed very strong reactions.
I think that progressive people are always like this, and if you do something new, some people will not like it.
Yes, it is always like that. In the face of new work, a new phenomenon, and a new style, there are always reactions. Positive reactions and very strong negative reactions. Because this new work breaks our mental habits.
Mr. Nalbandian had a significant impact on Iranian theater, on his generation and future generations. The issue you mentioned and to answer your question that I digressed from. Yes, his writings were very bold. Easy, frank, and explicit. At that time, so-called swearing and cursing were not common in theater. Theater was somewhat polite. But he had no qualms and used this type of language. Because in his opinion, this type of language existed among the common people. Every nation has this type of language. He was not a middle-ground and considerate person.
As far as I remember, after the revolution, the workshop theater was closed, and he was imprisoned for a while, and then he had a tragic death. How did he commit suicide? Do you have any information?
No, unfortunately, I was not in Iran. When I heard, I was very sorry. He was in prison for some time, unjustly. There was nothing against him. As I heard, one day a judge passed by the prison where he was and saw him and asked, 'What are you doing here?' He said, 'My name is this, and I am imprisoned here.' The judge then spoke with the prison authorities and said, 'He has done nothing; why is he in prison? Let him go.' They opened the prison door and said, 'Go.'
So there was no reason for his imprisonment, and it seems they had forgotten that he was in prison! I think the effects of that prison period and the fact that they could no longer work in theater had a very negative impact. He was also very young... He was about forty when he committed suicide.
He was forty years old. There is also a tape of his words at the time of his death... I mean, his last words are when... yes, he passed away. I mean, during the time he was finishing, he spoke on tape... It is tragic that a person with this talent that we had... It is very, very sad...
Your third guest is Hamid Samandarian, who is also one of the great directors of Iranian theater. How do you know Mr. Samandarian, and what memories do you have?
Guests of Sussan Taslimi: Hamid Samandarian
Hamid Samandarian (1931-2012): Iranian director and theater teacher Works: Hell, Ghosts, The Glass Menagerie, Rhinoceros, The Seagull, The Visit of the Old Lady, and other works Reason for invitation: The first time I can say I went on stage professionally was with him, and for this reason, he is dear to me.
Mr. Samandarian is dear to me because the first time I can say I went on stage professionally was with him. He was also my acting and speech teacher at the Faculty of Fine Arts. He studied in Germany, initially in a technical field, which I think was heating engineering...
Yes, heating engineering...
Yes, yes, that’s right. His theater education was also in Germany. Mr. Samandarian is important to me because he worked in a way with modern theater; contemporary Western theater. We owe a lot to Mr. Samandarian for introducing these works from European countries. Many of the European works that have been translated are due to his efforts.
He was one of them, 'The Caucasian Chalk Circle'...
Yes, yes. 'The Closed Doors' by Jean-Paul Sartre, and so on...
How did you know Mr. Samandarian besides the important works he did in Iranian theater?
He was very committed to discipline, order, and organization.
I think it was because he studied in Germany!
Absolutely. He was truly a product of education in German theater. He would get very angry if you were one minute late, if you did not maintain order. At the same time, with this serious and firm spirit he had, he was extremely kind. He was humorous, friendly. The combination of these two characteristics made working with him very pleasant.
He saw the necessity that we must connect with and understand Western theater. We should not only look at ourselves but open a window to other countries and become familiar with the philosophy of Western theater. And one thing that Mr. Samandarian criticized was that he absolutely did not like to work on Iranian plays, at all. I mean, his belief was that he said Iran has no theater. It seems he did not have much respect for Iranian playwrights.
No, I don’t think so... although he never explicitly told me, I mean, I did not hear it directly, but yes, he did not hold them in high regard. What he meant was that we do not have a history of theater in that way.
As far as I remember, Mr. Samandarian was purged for a while after the revolution during the cultural revolution, but later returned to theater.
Yes, they did not allow him to work. Because he had worked on the play 'The Caucasian Chalk Circle,' he was prevented from working on the accusation that he was a communist. Then he opened a restaurant to make a living, I think for a year or two. That restaurant was a failed project that fortunately closed down, and I am very happy that Mr. Samandarian returned to theater and did works after that.
He also passed away a few years ago, and may his memory be blessed.